We are Tooling them up

[pmartin]

EV's can also be part of the solution.

A huge drawback of 'green energy' is that it fluctuates with the wind and sun, so the power must be stored at the time of maximum production so it can be used during periods when it's dark or calm.

So instead of charging EV's at night, EV batteries could be charged during the day. Then overnight, that electricity is drawn out and used within the home.

Begging for a beat down in this forum are you?

No, No No, repeat after me.

Oil good, Solar bad, Wind bad, Hydro bad.

Now go home and practice that.

And remember humanity has never shown any ability to innovate their way around a problem.

[pmartin]

Edit:

It won't matter in 20 years anyway because most jobs will be automated and permanently unemployed people can't afford cars, EV or ICE

[Tim Johnson]

EV will have a short life. Hydrogen will be the eventual winner.

[DUM1]

mr fusion is all we need , should be here any day now , like the flying cars we were promised as kids

[gcode]

Oil good, Solar bad, Wind bad, Hydro bad.

the me fix that

oil good
natural gas f'ing great
hydro good
solar good, I;ve got one on my roof
wind... not economical

hydrogen.. I'll wait and see ...
when I think of hydrogen, I see a fender bender turning into a solar flare in the parking lot of Walmart

[pmartin]

Serve em right...I hate Walmart

[Tim Johnson]

the me fix that

oil good
natural gas f'ing great
hydro good
solar good, I;ve got one on my roof
wind... not economical

hydrogen.. I'll wait and see ...
when I think of hydrogen, I see a fender bender turning into a solar flare in the parking lot of Walmart

The turning point will be when it's feasible to separate the hydrogen from water.

[gcode]

The turning point will be when it's feasible to separate the hydrogen from water.

One issue is safe storage
A container of liquid hydrogen is a very powerful bomb looking for a match.
The trick will be to develop storage containers light enough to be practical in a vehicle
yet strong enough to withstand a high speed automobile crash. A crash that vents a tank of liquid hydrogen
will be 100% fatal to everyone involved.

Another issue is efficiency. With current technology, it takes far more energy to produce liquid hydrogen than the liquid hydrogen produces. I believe the ratio is 80/20.  In other words, producing the hydrogen creates far more green house gases than a hydrogen powered car saves.

The same could be said for the thousands of Teslas I see driving around town. The coal fired power plants that produce
the electricity the Teslas consume produce more pollution the than ICE cars the Teslas replaced.
The pollution is just happening somewhere else, far away.

Nuclear power plants could make both electric and hydrogen cars actually reduce green house gases, but we know that will never happen.

 

[mayday]

Ethanol isn't brought up much, to good for farmers I suppose.
How about fish oil, Del seems to light up all the time

[gcode]

Ethanol isn't brought up much, to good for farmers I suppose.
How about fish oil, Del seems to light up all the time

Ethanol is a political bribe to secure the votes of agricultural America.
It is a renewal form of energy, but it decimates the farmland that produces it
and it's production creates huge levels of green house gases.
Even Trump didn't have the balls to speak the truth about ethanol, even though he knows it's a boondoggle

[Tim Johnson]

One issue is safe storage
A container of liquid hydrogen is a very powerful bomb looking for a match.
The trick will be to develop storage containers light enough to be practical in a vehicle
yet strong enough to withstand a high speed automobile crash. A crash that vents a tank of liquid hydrogen
will be 100% fatal to everyone involved.

Another issue is efficiency. With current technology, it takes far more energy to produce liquid hydrogen than the liquid hydrogen produces. I believe the ratio is 80/20.  In other words, producing the hydrogen creates far more green house gases than a hydrogen powered car saves.

The same could be said for the thousands of Teslas I see driving around town. The coal fired power plants that produce
the electricity the Teslas consume produce more pollution the than ICE cars the Teslas replaced.
The pollution is just happening somewhere else, far away.

Nuclear power plants could make both electric and hydrogen cars actually reduce green house gases, but we know that will never happen.

 

The best hydrogen storage vessel is already here. It's called water. Eventually a person or a corporation will find a way to safely separate the hydrogen from the oxygen, the oil and power companies will fight like they've never fought before and then we will have a safe and never ending supply of power for any need. Will it be in our lifetime is the real question.

[gcode]

Eventually a person or a corporation will find a way to safely separate the hydrogen from the oxygen

Do you mean separate the hydrogen from water in the vehicle, so that in effect it is really just using water for fuel??
That will not happen in our lifetime. It would require hydrogen engines a million times more efficient that the ones we have today.
The amount of energy in the hydrogen in one gallon of water is miniscule.
Its not research I'd trust, but I read that it takes 66 gallons of water to produce one gallon of gaseous hydrogen
using Compressed Electrolysis

[Tim Johnson]

Do you mean separate the hydrogen from water in the vehicle, so that in effect it is really just using water for fuel??
That will not happen in our lifetime. It would require hydrogen engines a million times more efficient that the ones we have today.
The amount of energy in the hydrogen in one gallon of water is miniscule.
Its not research I'd trust, but I read that it takes 66 gallons of water to produce one gallon of gaseous hydrogen
using Compressed Electrolysis

I'm not saying it would be easy but with only one electron it would be the easiest of the elements to manipulate. I would suspect that one gallon of gaseous hydrogen is a bomb so separating it from the oxygen would need to be local and would need to be used instantly to avoid buildup. It very well may be long after we're dead but with hydrogen being the most abundant element in the universe it would only make sense to make use it as energy.

[gcode]

It very well may be long after we're dead but with hydrogen being the most abundant element in the universe it would only make sense to make use it as energy.

Ideally, they could develop a way to store it as an inert solid, like plastic explosive.
You can mold it, shape it, burn it to heat your coffee, even eat it and it's harmless until
you give it an explosive shock with a primer

[Incogneeto]

EV's can also be part of the solution.

A huge drawback of 'green energy' is that it fluctuates with the wind and sun, so the power must be stored at the time of maximum production so it can be used during periods when it's dark or calm.

So instead of charging EV's at night, EV batteries could be charged during the day. Then overnight, that electricity is drawn out and used within the home.

Sorry, I am so impressed with the stoopidity of your statement.

Where are the massive wind farms and solar grids you are talking about?

Where is your memory of Texas shutdown with the ice storm due to lack of electricity??

Solar and wind do not have the capability to power what you are saying.

Is that a battery in your pocket or are you happy to see me??