"Esprit for mill/turn and Mastercam for Mill" Why?

[Programinator]

Just was watching this video and the President of the company said that they use Esprit for Mill/turn and Mastercam for mill.  Looks like the company could afford Esprit for everything.  My question is why would they opt to use both the way they do.  We have use Mastercam and are currently testing out Esprit so thats why I am asking.

Here is the video link

https://youtu.be/o6NWZFoKSJs?si=oK_L5UpJ1oGPmsFR&t=799

[RobertELee]

Who hired that host? He's floored and never seen or heard of a machine cell? I assumed he was a machinist....

[JParis]

My question is why would they opt to use both the way they do.

Now, this is from several years back and I've not seen Esprit in wild around these parts lately....

A place I was doing contract work for, they were doing microwave housings that were going to be hermetically sealed...2 brothers owned the company. One of the brothers used Esprit to program.....so they started sending some work my way and eventually it came out that the brother using Esprit couldn't get a tool path on some features, critical features and Mastercam just a walk in the park. 

They eventually dropped Esprit for milling and went with Mastercam.

Has Esprit dealt with those milling shortcomings?? I cannot honestly say either way....

I cast no aspersions on the Mill/Turn product as I have consistently heard it's good....

[gcode]

My question is why would they opt to use both the way they do.  We have use Mastercam and are currently testing out Esprit so thats why I am asking.

When you get quotes for the post's you will need a paramedic to get you off the floor.
I evaluated Esprit in 2013 for our Okuma VTM-1200YB 5X Lathe and our MU1000H 5X HBM and
the quoted prices were breathtaking.

Didn't Espirt get bought out recently??

[Programinator]

We have used Mastercam for a long time.  Problem is we are getting into Mill/Turn and the programmer for that machine is having difficulty getting good programs for the machine.  I do all the 3,4,and 5axis machines but have nothing to do with the Mill/Turn.  The Mill/Turn Programmer is currently testing out Esprit and the idea to move everything over to Esprit is floating around.  I have not given my opinion on that idea yet.  Just preparing.

Sounds fun to learn a new Cad/Cam software after 20+ years of using mastercam.  We are a low production shop and i can pump out the programs fast in Mastercam.  So I dont know what to say.

Just thought i would get some thoughts.

[gcode]

Rouch Yates.. Mayday worked there for a while.
I haven't heard from him in a long time.

[JParis]

Problem is we are getting into Mill/Turn and the programmer for that machine is having difficulty getting good programs for the machine.

The larger question here is what is he using?  Mastercam Lathe/Mill or the MT module...

That leads to the next question of post issues, environment issues or programmer issues or a combination?

Post & environment issues can  both be addressed....programmer issues...even new software may not solve that issue.

[gcode]

We use Mastercam for our Okuma VTM-1200YB 5 axis lathe using a Postability post.
Mastercam Mill/Turn is not available for this machine.
It took nearly three years of work to get the post to 99% edit free code.
It works well, but it's not easy.
The biggest problem is that there are a lot of switches and misc intger settings needed to support
all the different stuff the Okuma can do.
If you don't use it all the time you forget the details and it becomes a struggle.
The other problem is, every time we get someone trained to set this machine up, they leave for
big $$$'s elsewhere.

[Programinator]

The larger question here is what is he using?  Mastercam Lathe/Mill or the MT module...

That leads to the next question of post issues, environment issues or programmer issues or a combination?

Post & environment issues can  both be addressed....programmer issues...even new software may not solve that issue.

Don't know the answers to these questions.  I stay away from the Mill/Turn dept.  Its better that way.  All I know is that I see plenty of obvious mill/turn parts come my way for programming on the 3,4,5 axis machines.  I'm just going to keep quiet for now.  Don't want to start a fire.  Just would hate for the company to spend lots of money on Esprit only to then go back to mastercam.  We will see what happens...

[gcode]

and I thought, your place paid the BIG bucks 

We pay pretty good, but can't compete with places like Spacex and Northrop
Since gas got so expensive some of the guys who left us for Spacex have
come back.
$6 gas and an 80 mile 5hr/day commute made us more attractive than it used to be.
Spacex used to run a bus for guys who lived in the high desert.
They'd pick you up about 3AM and get you home about 9PM with a 10 to 11 hour shift
in between. That's a young man's game that gets old very quick!!!
I don't make top $$$ for SoCal, but I've got a 12 mile commute... and that is worth a
whole lot to me.

[Jeff]

Didn't Espirt get bought out recently??

Hexagon bought out DP Technology (the developer of Esprit) back in 2020, or rather they announced the agreement to acquire it in November of 2020.

https://www.espritcam.com/article/dp-technology-announces-strategic-acquisition-by-hexagon-ab#:~:text=DP%20Technology%2C%20parent%20company%20of,on%20the%20global%20CAM%20marketplace.

[gcode]

It loos like the sale went thru
Hexagon is right there on page 1

Hexagon

[TSmcam]

Esprit is a very robust solution for Mill/Turn, and also Wire EDM. But, gcode is right in that the post processors are eyewateringly expensive. And, it has little to no CAD capability, which in todays CAD/CAM world, is pretty much a must. Mastercam has more robust CAD than Esprit.

Those of us that have been around since the cavemen know that Mastercam dropped the ball with Mill/Turn, while other companies picked up the ball and ran with it as Mill/Turn machines became more and more prevalent.

When companies choose software based on what the local college uses, or how popular it is out in the market (so it is easy to find programmers), that makes sense in the short term. But in reality, if find someone good, they will learn and adapt to whatever software is put before them. Other facets of software selection is post processor/kinematic model (if the software supports it) availability and cost, and support. Support is the big one in terms of reseller support and post processor support.

[Tim Johnson]

Don't know the answers to these questions.  I stay away from the Mill/Turn dept.  Its better that way.  All I know is that I see plenty of obvious mill/turn parts come my way for programming on the 3,4,5 axis machines.  I'm just going to keep quiet for now.  Don't want to start a fire.  Just would hate for the company to spend lots of money on Esprit only to then go back to mastercam.  We will see what happens...

That's what we did. Their mill-turn post was very clunky. For simple shapes it was efficient but for shapes more than simple it would write tool paths that would be four to six times the minutes that Mastercam would create. Some slots that require three passes would be as high as eight. I requested an editable post and was turned down. I tried communicating with their post writer and gave him about thirty issues I needed fixed and he didn't understand most of them. A lot of times I would add Mastercam code manually.

[CNCAppsJames]

Mastercam Lathe was so bad in 2008 that my boss PROHIBITED me from even mentioning Mastercam for use with any lathe with more than 1 turret. It wasn't until CAMplete introduced the Turn/Mill product that I could even mention it again. I was always able to work around it's deficiencies one way or another, but from an end user standpoint, that's kind of unacceptable IMHO. Perhap I lean too hard on my brute force approach to driving software, especially CAD/CAM.