New machine day!

[YoDoug]

In all seriousness, I would be perfectly fine with a Fanuc on a Matsuura or Nakamura. I think they both do a great job on their front end and integration. I just prefer the Okuma control because it makes it a lot easier to do some of the advanced customization I do for our needs.

[crazy^millman]

In all seriousness, I would be perfectly fine with a Fanuc on a Matsuura or Nakamura. I think they both do a great job on their front end and integration. I just prefer the Okuma control because it makes it a lot easier to do some of the advanced customization I do for our needs.

See and I will take the Siemens 840D over them both. Their support of TRAORI and CYCLE 800 are amazing. Interpolated turning and RAH support with a control setup correctly by the builder is top notch also. Fanuc's problem is the builders integrating them correctly. Some do a great job, but the majority just suck at it plain and simple. That sucking is what gives advanced users frustration. Then you have to become a Fanuc guru like you are on the OSP controls to really make them do what is needed. The control is a part of the equation the real magic you are doing is in the I/O and external Ladder logic with the PLC controls. You need some basic on off commands and other things, but the other parts are controlled with external controls as it should be. Let the CNC do what is meant to do and let the external PLC and other items do what they are meant to do.

EDIT:
Makino was a top notch machine I forgot to mention. They make great machines on the top end, but their entry level machines are comparable to HAAS IMHO.

Like you mentioned I think Matsurra and Nakamura do the best job, but seeing what Doosan is doing as of late and they are stepping up their game on the control side. Sorry still don't put them in the same league as either mentioned above, but they are doing some very impressive things IMHO.

DMG/Mori has done a decent process with the control. The DMU line is what is giving others a run for their money. The Mori side not so much anymore.

Mazak is another control you have to live it and breathe it to make it do it's best. You can do a lot with those machines, but you need to eat live and breathe it to be great at it.  

Heideneihan is control I have limited experience with, but they do a great job on he machines I have dealt with.

That all said how much of your custom developed stuff have you give to other users for free? You shouldn't be since it is what makes your company great at what they do. If you are giving to much of what your doing away then your company is going to lose its competitive edge. Easy to cast stones at AE's but that knowledge is what allows them their edges. Not everyone is crazy like me always sharing and giving away too much.  

Sorry for the long winded response I know it drives so many around me crazy.

[Matthew Hajicek]

I'm pretty sure people use fanuc controls for the same reason people like to hunt with black powder and recurve bows.

How do you use black power with a bow?  Explosive arrows?

[mkd]

oh and where's mkd to wax lyrical about the Heidy controls?
 

Well I did spank a genos 460 5ax in an impeller test after a couple months on the job with an entry level Heidy controlled mill. Lots of things fell into place to make it happen, along with some help from thee circle.
 Heidy makes 5 axis easy, similar to Siemens.
 Not sure what is involved in getting the OEM front ends applied to a Fanuc. No real need to do it on a Heidy. Best probing cycles in the industry and prodigious customization available in stock form.

 I like the OSP7000 mac turn I run. I think it is very well thought out and intuitive to navigate. Heidy is a fucking navigation cluster fuck.
End
End
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[beej]

[quote="Matthew Hajicek" post_id=10254 time=1619633384 user_id=57]

I'm pretty sure people use fanuc controls for the same reason people like to hunt with black powder and recurve bows.

How do you use black power with a bow?  Explosive arrows?
[/quote]

I suppose I should have said "or" rather than "and".  

[mkd]

what's the 5-axis performance difference between the genos 460 and MU-4000?

[gcode]

[quote="Matthew Hajicek" post_id=10254 time=1619633384 user_id=57]

I'm pretty sure people use fanuc controls for the same reason people like to hunt with black powder and recurve bows.

How do you use black power with a bow?  Explosive arrows?
[/quote]
you carry a black powder pistol for the mercy kill

[YoDoug]

what's the 5-axis performance difference between the genos 460 and MU-4000?

Not a lot. The controls are spec'd almost the same. The MU-4000V has 5 place after the decimal. Other than that they have the same options for 5x, high speed cutting , etc. They both have the 5x auto-tuning compensation option. The MU does have the collision software, however none of our other mills have it so I doubt we will use it. We do have it in our LT and Multus machines and use it for every tool/program. The MU has a little more travel allowing a taller part when tip to 90 degrees. The main reason we went with the MU is our Genos only has a 48ATC and it is full. The MU came with a 64ATC.

[Zoober]

It all boils down to the builder, and their target market.
Most of our machines are two to four channel controls. Even the single turret, single spindle is a 2 channel control.
Ladders are tuned to allow simultaneous functions to occur in parallel, that other builders run in serial.
That's how we just kicked a citizen m32 run medical part cycle time by a third. 3 tools in the cut at once will blow any Citizen (or Okuma) away. I don't care how many plc's you customize.
A full channel designated to the parts ejection and gantries for in cycle ejection? Standard.
Automation is in the standard makeup of our machines.
In Fanuc or Mits controls.
We simply take the need for a Yodoug out of the picture.
Our machines come with Mydoug. 😂😂

[byte]

It all boils down to the builder, and their target market.
Most of our machines are two to four channel controls. Even the single turret, single spindle is a 2 channel control.
Ladders are tuned to allow simultaneous functions to occur in parallel, that other builders run in serial.
That's how we just kicked a citizen m32 run medical part cycle time by a third. 3 tools in the cut at once will blow any Citizen (or Okuma) away. I don't care how many plc's you customize.
A full channel designated to the parts ejection and gantries for in cycle ejection? Standard.
Automation is in the standard makeup of our machines.
In Fanuc or Mits controls.
We simply take the need for a Yodoug out of the picture.
Our machines come with Mydoug. 😂😂

Is you machine vegan?
Asking for a friend.
 :w00t:

[YoDoug]

It all boils down to the builder, and their target market.
Most of our machines are two to four channel controls. Even the single turret, single spindle is a 2 channel control.
Ladders are tuned to allow simultaneous functions to occur in parallel, that other builders run in serial.
That's how we just kicked a citizen m32 run medical part cycle time by a third. 3 tools in the cut at once will blow any Citizen (or Okuma) away. I don't care how many plc's you customize.
A full channel designated to the parts ejection and gantries for in cycle ejection? Standard.
Automation is in the standard makeup of our machines.
In Fanuc or Mits controls.
We simply take the need for a Yodoug out of the picture.
Our machines come with Mydoug. 😂😂

What builder are you working for now? Didn't you move to TN to work for a med device mfg?

Also for the record, Okuma LT machines with built in gantry (2 or 3 turret) can do all of those functions (multi-channel cutting and part loading) simultaneously. The reason why we do our own automation is to make it completely customized to our needs. Just about every builder we had quote machines offered one of two automation solutions. The first was some sort of OEM integral gantry/pallet loader. These were limited in size/scope/operation. The second option was usually a custom automation integration like we do here for ourselves. Only we could do it for less money and in less time
">

[mkd]

3 turret, 2 spindles:
F'THAT

[neurosis]

We simply take the need for a Yodoug out of the picture.
Our machines come with Mydoug. 😂😂

    Lol.. I read that and almost spit some drink out.  

[Zoober]

It all boils down to the builder, and their target market.
Most of our machines are two to four channel controls. Even the single turret, single spindle is a 2 channel control.
Ladders are tuned to allow simultaneous functions to occur in parallel, that other builders run in serial.
That's how we just kicked a citizen m32 run medical part cycle time by a third. 3 tools in the cut at once will blow any Citizen (or Okuma) away. I don't care how many plc's you customize.
A full channel designated to the parts ejection and gantries for in cycle ejection? Standard.
Automation is in the standard makeup of our machines.
In Fanuc or Mits controls.
We simply take the need for a Yodoug out of the picture.
Our machines come with Mydoug. 😂😂

What builder are you working for now? Didn't you move to TN to work for a med device mfg?

Also for the record, Okuma LT machines with built in gantry (2 or 3 turret) can do all of those functions (multi-channel cutting and part loading) simultaneously. The reason why we do our own automation is to make it completely customized to our needs. Just about every builder we had quote machines offered one of two automation solutions. The first was some sort of OEM integral gantry/pallet loader. These were limited in size/scope/operation. The second option was usually a custom automation integration like we do here for ourselves. Only we could do it for less money and in less time
">

We kinda got the band back together. I left med. I now work for Eurotech. The Biglia and CMZ importers.
Here is a video of the Citizen killer.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/d0d3wo2oiwwsvz6/AABkAuUaSP3rCjEvbREHswpva?dl=0">https://www.dropbox.com/sh/d0d3wo2oiwws ... swpva?dl=0">https://www.dropbox.com/sh/d0d3wo2oiwwsvz6/AABkAuUaSP3rCjEvbREHswpva?dl=0

 This was just the first run in brass. We are doing Cobalt Chrome under 2 minutes.  
Not near the behemoth you showed, but we make those as well. Just not my focus. I own medical apps at the moment.
This little twin spindle twin turret Rapido owns guns, and is going to own medical. Hence me moving.
I worked with these guys in '88. We are just getting the band back for a world tour.
This week I'm at Kel-tec, cutting cycle times by 1/3 to help eliminate a 68,000 gun back order.

Edit: the purpose of my original post wasn't to out big-duck Okuma. We are small time compared to them.
My point was a Fanuc is every bit as capable in the right hands as any Okuma.
But I stand by my statement that we will beat Okuma (or any other Japanese Mfgr) in ANY cycle time or productivity test. Hands down.

[mkd]

@zoober, isn't the cycle time competition more about matching the perfect part with the perfect machine size. .. just big enough to make.