What is a "Programmer"

[gcode]

That's funny, I do not miss it...I was very over standing at a machine and making parts.

I don't miss running a machine but I do miss seeing and hearing my files run
I frequently watch a new file run and realize it could be better.

[crazy^millman]

I don't miss running a machine but I do miss seeing and hearing my files run
I frequently watch a new file run and realize it could be better.

Yes and the other thing being a machinist for as many years as we have we just know certain things seeing and hearing it run that many others never see or even pay attention to.

[TSmcam]

I still take some programmes and run them. I have the luxury of picking and choosing. Normally it is the 5 axis and complex Mill/Turn stuff.

It is nice to keep the practical aspect on board, but not having to do it day in/day out.

[neurosis]

Like others have said, I like running first run parts, first part or two only.  Especially the more trick/fun parts. It always helps to get an eye and ear on what's going on at the machine to help streamline the program.

Other than that, I've been over running parts for about the last 5 or 6 years.  I used to really enjoy it, but now it just feels monotonous.   

[Milagroman]

es and the other thing being a machinist for as many years as we have we just know certain things seeing and hearing it run that many others never see or even pay attention to.

A lot of times when I go into a customer's site to do a run off, they will offer me desk space in their engineering office.  I politley decline and ask for a table and chair at the machine.  I want to hear and see everything that is going on.  That also gives me better accessability to the person running the machine and makes it easier for them to ask me quesitons or offer suggestions.  (and roll our eyes at the "engineers")

For those of you who don't know, Milagroman is Bill Craven.

[JakeL]

6 months before graduating high school I talked to the VP of a local machine shop and asked what he recommended I do if I want to be a CNC Programmer. He told me that when I graduate, he'd hire me as a machinist because to be a good programmer you need to be a machinist first. (At this time I barely knew the difference between a drill and an end mill). This shop does a lot of different work but mainly aerospace and defense industry work. We frequently have customers ask us personally to make their parts because no one will quote them because of some ridiculously tight tolerances on the print. We do whatever it takes to hit the tolerances, but it usually costs them big time.

To make a long story short, I started as an operator and grew into a machinist. I ran various machines for a year and a half, then got transitioned to full-time programming. I've been in the chair 2 years now and programmed a wide variety of parts from little 3-axis trinkets all the way up to 3+2 axis parts. There's still so much for me to learn but I assume I'm not doing too bad because I've been asked to train the other programmers at the shop.

If you ask me:
Operator - someone who can push a green button and inspect a couple dimensions on a part

Machinist - someone who can setup and prove out new programs from the programmer - they are capable of tweaking the program when the cut doesn't sound or feel right

Programmer - someone who can take a print and/or a 3D model and come up with a process and write a program to machine the part from a solid piece of stock to the finished part

[Jim at Gentex]

If you ask me:
Operator - someone who can push a green button and inspect a couple dimensions on a part

Machinist - someone who can setup and prove out new programs from the programmer - they are capable of tweaking the program when the cut doesn't sound or feel right

Programmer - someone who can take a print and/or a 3D model and come up with a process and write a program to machine the part from a solid piece of stock to the finished part

Welcome Jake!

To add to one of your definitions,
'Machinist' is also someone who can set up and operate manual mills, lathes, surface grinders, etc...

Many of us here who are let's say, age 60 or older started our careers as manual machinists long before CNC machines were even a thing.

We learned mostly on Bridgeport milling machines and manual engine lathes, then we transitioned that skillset over to the CNC arena as Operators, and eventually Programmers.

Most schools don't even teach the fundamentals on the manual machines anymore, which is a shame.
But our industry has changed, so many of the younger guys today never had the opportunity to learn the old school way of doing things. 

[mega]

6 months before graduating high school I talked to the VP of a local machine shop and asked what he recommended I do if I want to be a CNC Programmer. He told me that when I graduate, he'd hire me as a machinist because to be a good programmer you need to be a machinist first. (At this time I barely knew the difference between a drill and an end mill). This shop does a lot of different work but mainly aerospace and defense industry work. We frequently have customers ask us personally to make their parts because no one will quote them because of some ridiculously tight tolerances on the print. We do whatever it takes to hit the tolerances, but it usually costs them big time.

To make a long story short, I started as an operator and grew into a machinist. I ran various machines for a year and a half, then got transitioned to full-time programming. I've been in the chair 2 years now and programmed a wide variety of parts from little 3-axis trinkets all the way up to 3+2 axis parts. There's still so much for me to learn but I assume I'm not doing too bad because I've been asked to train the other programmers at the shop.

If you ask me:
Operator - someone who can push a green button and inspect a couple dimensions on a part

Machinist - someone who can setup and prove out new programs from the programmer - they are capable of tweaking the program when the cut doesn't sound or feel right

Programmer - someone who can take a print and/or a 3D model and come up with a process and write a program to machine the part from a solid piece of stock to the finished part

Welcome Jake!! 
It's great to see young people getting in the trade, there has been a lack of programmers for sure the last few years..

I would define the roles something like this :

- CNC Operator - Pushes the green button and puts parts in and out of the vise
- Setup Guy - Installs the vise or fixture, sets the offsets, loads and runs the first part
- CNC Programmer - Creates G-Code somehow from a model or print
- Planner - Creates a work order outlining the Steps for the programmer, operator & setup guy to follow
- Manufacturing Engineer - Creates the fixture 3D Models, Work Instructions for the Process
- Mechanical/Design Engineer - Creates the 3D Model to build

Of course not all of those roles exist in every company,

[JParis]

- CNC Programmer - Creates G-Code somehow from a model or print
- Planner - Creates a work order outlining the Steps for the programmer, operator & setup guy to follow
- Manufacturing Engineer - Creates the fixture 3D Models, Work Instructions for the Process

I guess I should be getting paid for doing 3 jobs 

[Matthew Hajicek]

I guess I should be getting paid for doing 3 jobs 

Only three?

[JParis]

Only three?

I was thinking the same thing after I posted that lol

[crazy^millman]

Welcome Jake!! 
It's great to see young people getting in the trade, there has been a lack of programmers for sure the last few years..

I would define the roles something like this :

- CNC Operator - Pushes the green button and puts parts in and out of the vise
- Setup Guy - Installs the vise or fixture, sets the offsets, loads and runs the first part
- CNC Programmer - Creates G-Code somehow from a model or print
- Planner - Creates a work order outlining the Steps for the programmer, operator & setup guy to follow
- Manufacturing Engineer - Creates the fixture 3D Models, Work Instructions for the Process
- Mechanical/Design Engineer - Creates the 3D Model to build
- Manual Machinist can setup and operate manual equipment to make a part. Mill Vertical or Horizontal, Lathe Vertical or Horizontal, Surface Grinder, Jig Grinder, Radial Drill Press, Broaching, Bench Press or Hydraulic Press, Lapping, deburring and other manual tasks need to make a part. 
- CNC Machinist can setup, operate and make parts on CNC Turning centers from Vertical to Horizontal 2 Axis all the way up to 21 axis, and/or CNC milling Centers 3-6 Axis Vertical to Horizontal with Head-Head, Head-Table, Head-Head-Table, Table-Head, Nutating Head-Table, Nutating Table-Head and etc.... and/or Swiss, and/or EDM wire or Sinker. It also can be even more specialized but can do it all to make a part complete. 

Of course not all of those roles exist in every company,

Sorry you left out two things on your list I can do or currently do depending on the customer. Yes I have not been on manual machine in over 10 years, but I can still find my away around them and would feel comfortable doing so.

[Tim Johnson]

I guess I should be getting paid for doing 3 jobs 

I'm not sure that I would want a planner and/or a manufacturing engineer getting in my way of programming.

[neurosis]

I guess I should be getting paid for doing 3 jobs 

You and me both. At any given time I'm filling at least 5 of those positions.   

Some times I'm barely filling one so I guess it evens out. 

[JParis]

I'm not sure that I would want a planner and/or a manufacturing engineer getting in my way of programming.

Yeah, I just don't handle the scheduling end of it or decide where it'll go...now adding on top of all of that, the mfg review of all machined parts, the additive manufacturing, frankly it's taking up a good deal of my time, and all of the rest I was doing...design reviews, managing, putting out fires, thankfully not too many of those...

I'm wearing a lot of hats at any momnet during a day.