Yesterday's Shooting

[Matthew Hajicek]

First off, I believe there was no mens rea here, that the officer did indeed accidentally grab her pistol instead of her taser.  That said, what happened was preventable, and a symptom of several deeper problems.  For one, apparently the guy's warrant was for exercising his second amendment rights without asking permission first, and then for running away from the cops who attempted to enforce this unconstitutional law.  One can point out that what he did wasn't smart, but it's harder to ague that it was wrong or harmful to anyone but himself.  For another, I think that tasers are employed far to rapidly in many situations; they seem to be a first response tool, when they were intended to be a less harmful substitute for lethal force.

  This is not the first time I've heard of a cop killing someone with their pistol when they meant to use their taser.  Partly I believe this is an engineering problem; there needs to be greater difference in the form factor of the taser from that of the pistol to minimize accidental substitution.

  There are some good points here about over-criminalization; the guy was pulled over for an air freshener.  Since every interaction between cops and the rest of us has a chance of going lethal, we need to minimize those interactions to those which are absolutely necessary:
https://reason.com/2021/04/12/overcriminalization-killed-daunte-wright-police-shooting-brooklyn-center-minnesota-air-freshener/">https://reason.com/2021/04/12/overcrimi ... freshener/">https://reason.com/2021/04/12/overcriminalization-killed-daunte-wright-police-shooting-brooklyn-center-minnesota-air-freshener/

[Del.]

You couldn't have written a worse scenario to the already bad situation.

[marshal]

to be fair, the guy was pulled over for expired tabs, which I'm sure many of us have been pulled over for.

[Jeff]

Don't flee from the police or resist arrest. It's common sense. If he wouldn't have attempted to flee, the officer wouldn't have had to attempt to taze him. Did he deserve to die? Of course not, but he chose to escalate the situation, not the officers.

How the hell do you mistake a gun for a taser? I guess maybe she panicked? With all of that bullshit "protesting" going on for the Chauvin trial I can see where she would have nervous and on edge. Hell I would be if I was an officer in that city.

[gcode]

the cop is a 25 year vet and in this atmosphere she is toast.
the dead guy did not deserve what happened to him, but he is complicate in his dead.
Had he complied with the officers orders, he's have gotten a ticket at worse
Instead he choose to fight and he got killed.

A city administrator was fired yesterday after issuing a press release stating
the office deserved due process. The world is going completely insane.

[Jeff]

A city administrator was fired yesterday after issuing a press release stating
the office deserved due process.

That person needs to file a massive lawsuit.

[Matthew Hajicek]

I agree that firing anyone over this is inappropriate.

More on this recurring phenomenon:

https://apnews.com/article/how-does-police-use-gun-instead-of-taser-explained-e6bb9c49b1bcdc244e3ec11d94137c82">https://apnews.com/article/how-does-pol ... 1d94137c82">https://apnews.com/article/how-does-police-use-gun-instead-of-taser-explained-e6bb9c49b1bcdc244e3ec11d94137c82

What do you guys think there are in the way of practical solutions?  I think that in addition to changing the form factor of the taser (maybe a baton shape?), it may help to add tase/kill training to shoot/don't-shoot training, getting the officers to practice employing their tasers at least as often as they practice employing their sidearms.  When you're under stress you fall back to what you've practiced most.

[Jeff]

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[TylerBeer]

Anyone here been cuffed for having expired tags?

Could've given the guy a ticket and moved on.

Mistaking your gun for a taser is fucking stupid. Glad to hear she resigned. Maybe at her next job if she mistakes a burger for double burger a kid won't die.

[RobertELee]

Anyone here been cuffed for having expired tags?

Could've given the guy a ticket and moved on.

Mistaking your gun for a taser is fucking stupid. Glad to hear she resigned. Maybe at her next job if she mistakes a burger for double burger a kid won't die.

He was cuffed for having a warrant. The expired tags were what got him pulled over. Maybe you should get facts before spewing your bullshit.

[neurosis]

Mistaking your gun for a taser is fucking stupid. Glad to hear she resigned. Maybe at her next job if she mistakes a burger for double burger a kid won't die.

I'd have to agree with this.  

It's unbelievable that someone with 20+ years of experience would do something this stupid. She has no business with a firearm in her hands. This was either a horrible lack of training or she just isn't cut out for that job.

[Del.]

Anyone here been cuffed for having expired tags?

Could've given the guy a ticket and moved on.

Mistaking your gun for a taser is fucking stupid. Glad to hear she resigned. Maybe at her next job if she mistakes a burger for double burger a kid won't die.

He was cuffed because he had outstanding warrants for failure to show up to court for having a gun and waiving it about 2 years ago dumbass

[Del.]

Anyone here been cuffed for having expired tags?

Could've given the guy a ticket and moved on.

Mistaking your gun for a taser is fucking stupid. Glad to hear she resigned. Maybe at her next job if she mistakes a burger for double burger a kid won't die.

He was cuffed for having a warrant. The expired tags were what got him pulled over. Maybe you should get facts before spewing your bullshit.

No shit   He just makes facts up.

[RobertELee]

Anyone here been cuffed for having expired tags?

Could've given the guy a ticket and moved on.

Mistaking your gun for a taser is fucking stupid. Glad to hear she resigned. Maybe at her next job if she mistakes a burger for double burger a kid won't die.

He was cuffed for having a warrant. The expired tags were what got him pulled over. Maybe you should get facts before spewing your bullshit.

No shit   He just makes facts up.

I'm sure he's also still believing the bullshit story that Fuckbook and Twatter were spewing about him being killed over an air freshener.

[gcode]

It's unbelievable that someone with 20+ years of experience would do something this stupid. She has no business with a firearm in her hands. This was either a horrible lack of training or she just isn't cut out for that job.

until you've been in life or death combat a statement like that is just ignorant armchair quarterbacking

she made the correct decision to resign.
she is a 25 year veteran with a solid record.
In today's environment, that counts for nothing and trying to save her job is a lost cause.
She is taking her pension and walking... though I wouldn't be surprised if the disloyal asshats
she works for don't try to claw back her pension.