And They Said it Wouldn't Happen

[CNCAppsJames]

Every meaningful statistic gathered since the 1920's  point to when people are "allowed" to keep more of THEIR money they are more generous. Tax rates go up giving goes down. Takes rates go up, R&D expenditures go down. Tax rates go up the ONLY thing that benefits is alphabet soup.

#TaxationIsTheft

Change my mind.

[CNCAppsJames]

I would trust CNN before any one of those Three.

Just so I'm clear.... it's fringe to source info trom "those three" AND it's fringe to distrust government?

[Jon@NOWHERE]

Or I understand basic economics. My economics teacher is Thomas Sowell. Who is yours?

He's a Paul Krugman guy...

[beej]

The reality is the rich get richer while the poor get poorer. You do understand wealth disparity right?

I think it's overstated. In america, the rich have gotten richer and the poor have also got richer. Most of us on this forum and right smack in the middle of middle class. And I bet that we have more than our parents did.

For me personally, my dad grew up in a farm cabin with no indoor plumbing, and no electric. He actually ran electric in his mom and dad's house after he got married. He grew up with an Icebox that literally took a block of ice to keep food cold. He grew up got a job working for a company that provided health insurance, a pension, paid vacation. he bought a refrigerator, and an electric stove. He made $8 an hour and raised 7 kids on that, while mom stayed home to tend to us. He had more than his parents had, and Now I have considerably more than he ever had.

The poorest in America are still in the top 10% wealthiest people in the world. In my grandparent's day, poor people were skinny. they didn't have food to eat. Today many of our poorest people are overweight, they have phones that they carry with them. they can get insurance that they don't have to pay for.

For me, I don't really care about how rich, Bill Gates is, or Elon Musk, or Soros, or Koch. I could have worked toward attaining that kind of wealth if I had really wanted it bad enough. I chose a different path because I wanted something different than what they have. And you did too.

But here is a thought exercise for you. If you just got rid of the billionaires. Took all their money away. And let's pretend that, that doesn't destroy the economy. the Billionaires are all gone. Now who is going to own the politicians? Will it be the homeless people or will it be the millionaires?  Take away the millionaires, then who owns the politicians, will it be the homeless people or will it be the hundred-thousandaires? 

Go ahead show me how to make a perfect society in your image.

[crazy^millman]

I think it's overstated. In america, the rich have gotten richer and the poor have also got richer. Most of us on this forum and right smack in the middle of middle class. And I bet that we have more than our parents did.

For me personally, my dad grew up in a farm cabin with no indoor plumbing, and no electric. He actually ran electric in his mom and dad's house after he got married. He grew up with an Icebox that literally took a block of ice to keep food cold. He grew up got a job working for a company that provided health insurance, a pension, paid vacation. he bought a refrigerator, and an electric stove. He made $8 an hour and raised 7 kids on that, while mom stayed home to tend to us. He had more than his parents had, and Now I have considerably more than he ever had.

The poorest in America are still in the top 10% wealthiest people in the world. In my grandparent's day, poor people were skinny. they didn't have food to eat. Today many of our poorest people are overweight, they have phones that they carry with them. they can get insurance that they don't have to pay for.

For me, I don't really care about how rich, Bill Gates is, or Elon Musk, or Soros, or Koch. I could have worked toward attaining that kind of wealth if I had really wanted it bad enough. I chose a different path because I wanted something different than what they have. And you did too.

But here is a thought exercise for you. If you just got rid of the billionaires. Took all their money away. And let's pretend that, that doesn't destroy the economy. the Billionaires are all gone. Now who is going to own the politicians? Will it be the homeless people or will it be the millionaires?  Take away the millionaires, then who owns the politicians, will it be the homeless people or will it be the hundred-thousandaires? 

Go ahead show me how to make a perfect society in your image.

Good luck we are rooting for you.   

[Smit]

Go ahead show me how to make a perfect society in your image.

Who, besides you, has been talking about a "perfect" society? 

[beej]

Who, besides you, has been talking about a "perfect" society? 

I thought maybe you had more to offer than complaining.

[Smit]

I thought maybe you had more to offer than complaining.

Ah I see.

I'll try to come up with a simple ass story with horseys that may be easier for you to understand.

[neurosis]

He made $8 an hour and raised 7 kids on that, while mom stayed home to tend to us.

How many fathers do you know these days that are able to raise a 7 (even 2 or 3) kid family on a single person income? I know a small hand full and they all have 4 year College degrees and work in the tech industry. How many families do you know these days that can purchase a house on a single person income before they're 30? I don't know any right now. 

The age of first time home buyers is higher than ever and I'm not sure that some of these younger generations will ever own their own homes unless they inherit the house or the money from their family.

When you see people talking about a growing wealth gap these are the issues that are typically part of that discussion. I get tired of seeing the stereotypical 'millennial attitude' when it comes to being willing to put extra effort in to your future, and I don't feel as sorry for millennials as the generations after, but some of their complaints are legit. 

[beej]

How many families do you know these days that can purchase a house on a single person income before they're 30? I don't know any right now.

My Son(Electrician) and his wife, and my daughter and her husband(UPS driver). My Son went to a Trade School, came out with about 15,000 in student loans, and at age 27 now owns 2 houses. He's buying fixer-uppers, for rentals. My daughter has 3 kids and she homeschools them while her husband works at UPS. They just built their own house 2 years ago.

It can be done, but it takes sacrifice and hard work.

[crazy^millman]

I thought maybe you had more to offer than complaining.

       

You can do it we got faith in you.

       

He does he is really good at not understanding most things I type and name calling so he does have that going for him.

[beej]

Ah I see.

I'll try to come up with a simple ass story with horseys that may be easier for you to understand.

Simple is good. Also, Make sure you get the messaging right. I know that democrats never have bad ideas just poor messaging. 

[Smit]

Simple is good. Also, Make sure you get the messaging right. I know that democrats never have bad ideas just poor messaging. 

Haha, yeah, I do wish I could figure out how to "message" a Republican so they'd understand simple nuance. That would probably change the world. 

[crazy^millman]

Haha, yeah, I do wish I could figure out how to "message" a Republican so they'd understand simple nuance. That would probably change the world. 

Like I said never disappoints at the name calling and belittling of people he considers inferior to himself.

[beej]

Haha, yeah, I do wish I could figure out how to "message" a Republican so they'd understand simple nuance. That would probably change the world. 

the thing about nuance, it always seems to be a "Yes for me but none for thee" kind of thing. Democrats and Republicans both never seem to see the nuance in each other's argument. they usually just condense down a person's reasoning to some simple caricature of what was said. It's a pretty good indication that your point has hit home when someone, rather than countering the argument with a better one, they just condense it down to something like "Horsey Story" and moves on.